Quit bashing the Skeptics

Geri_Berri · **Geri_Berri**

I have been on these forums a lot in the week or so since I joined. At first it was hugely interesting; seeing how people view things differently and learning why, learning all manner of new things, listening to theories, formualting responses, doing research, marvelling at the knowledge and eloquence of many of the people here.

Now, I seem to spend all my time defending myself against attacks on me for what I believe. I have been called closed-minded, ignorant, incapable of independant thought, gullible, lazy, deaf, dumb and blind. I have been accused of saying that all people who have seen ghosts / aliens / something they couldn't explain are hallucinating / liars / drunk. I have been accused of ignoring people's opinions and disrespecting their right to disagree.

I am a skeptic and every time someone (and there are many) attacks skeptics for any and all of the above, they are attacking me just as they would be if they said white people are racist or atheists are evil as I am both white and an atheist.

At first I tried to maintain my dignity and responded to these accusations in a calm, reasonable and non-confrontational manner, but the attacks are relentless and seemingly increasing. I leave one thread that has descended into a - "skeptics ignore evidence"..."they are not skeptics"..."skeptics are closed-minded"..."they are NOT skeptics"..."skeptics think everyone is lying"..."THEY ARE NOT SKEPTICS" - merry-go-round and then, on another thread, am right back in the thick of it.

(mentioning no names) Someone posted a topic asking why believers belive what they do and why skeptics believe what they do. The poster expressed the sincere hope that the thread wouldn't turn into a skeptic versus believer fight and yet, on page one, up pops one of the usual suspects saying "skeptics are just closed-minded...".

So, exhausted from defending that at length with other skeptics on two previous threads, I decide I've had enough of that and try something else. What do I find on the very next thread? Someone who I thought was better than this saying "skpetics think everyone in that group that saw the ghost was drunk".

I defended this person against someone who called her a moron and an idiot for believeing in god but not the bible. I don't believe in either but I defended her because no one should be insulted for what they believe. And I would defend her again. Challenge what people are saying by all means, that is what these forums are, at least in part, for. Don't challenge people based on prejudice against their system of beliefs or what they choose to call themselves.

Example 1:

a - "Ghosts exist"
b - "I don't think it can be stated as a fact that they exist"
a - "But what about all the people who have seen them?"
b - "Well, it's possible that they were mistaken"
a - "Ok, but how do you explain..."

Good. Fine.

Example 2:

a - "Ghosts exist"
b - "I don't think it can be stated as a fact that they exist"
a - "The evidence is there if you bothered to look. Skeptics always say these people are lying but never consider that they might not be. Skeptics never accept the possibility that their explanation might not be the only one possibe..."

Hypocritical and insulting attack.

The vast majority of people on these forums have respect for each other regardless of their beliefs. Just like I would not call all believers in god rude and insulting because I read a rude and insulting post from one, it angers me when people do the same with us skeptics. A few people are determined and consistent to reduce every topic they are a part of into a discreditation of skeptics and skepticism based on the actions of a very, very small minority of us, half truths, hypocrasy, and outright lies.

I am asking the people who do this habitually to please stop. It may not be your intention to offend anyone but you are doing just that. Skeptics accept that they will get a certain amount of grief as they are seen by many as the "party poopers", but it's becoming endemic in these forums. I realise that, for some of you, it is very difficult for you to understand how anyone can disagree with something that you see as so obvious without them being deficient in some way or just plain obnoxious but please try to leave this out of the discussions or at least phrase it in a non-combative manner.

I may have a different set of beliefs to you but that does not mean that I believe them less or that they are less important to me. I will discuss my beliefs happily for hours on end with anyone who cares to listen and will listen to others in the same way. We may disagree and I fully expect that we will. It doesn't even matter to me whether we reach an agreement one way or the other as I am here for the journey more than the destination. It is just difficult to keep making the effort when that journey is constantly being sabotaged by people throwing stones.

Please try to remember that people who disagree with you may feel just as strongly as you and may have arrived at that point after just as much informed consideration.

Thank you all for your time reading this.

As a footnote, here are some (not all) popular misconceptions about skeptics. Please ask yourself if any of these mirror your thoughts:

1. Skeptics don't believe in anything.

They do, and just as strongly as any belief you may hold. Beliefs are not restricted to spirituality, the paranormal, etc. The belief that the earth is round is a belief. I actually know of a person who believes that the earth is flat (amongst other things). Call him what you like - and many have - he believes this with every fibre of his being.

2. Skeptics ignore evidence. Smilie_PDT

They do not. They may question the validity of that evidence. They may suggest a different possibility. They do not ignore it. A skeptic's raison d'etre is to introduce reasonable doubt into any theory that is offered as proof of something. Without considering the evidence it is impossible to do that effectively. When a skeptic attempts to debunk a medium, for example, they study the medium minutely. They record sessions and play them back over and over again analysing every word, noting down hits and misses, what the subject said, how the medium reacted, cross referencing returns to other subjects, etc. They also investigate events outside of the session including the medium themselves, what they have said in the past, their history, their lifestyle. Then they look at the partcipants, the environment, etc., etc., etc. Sure there are those that don't go to all this trouble and use the work that others have done already but does that mean that the research is any less thorough (not conclusive, thorough)?

Related to this is the accusation that skeptics never provide evidence that aliens / ghosts / god / etc do NOT exist. Without believers, skeptics could not exist. The reverse is not true. Asking a skeptic to prove that these things don't exist is like asking someone to prove they have not committed any murders. Suggest a specific murder and give me some details then I can show you that I was somewhere else or whatever. If you simply ask, "prove you've never committed any murders", how can I possibly do that?

3. Skeptics are afraid of the truth. Smilie_PDT

Ask yourself this, who has the most to lose if they are wrong? If skeptics are wrong then it means that there is actually a greater purpose or a grander design. If they are wrong then our lives are more meaningful, more interesting, more wonderful. If skeptics are right then it means we are just a collection of cells that essentially serve no purpose other than to keep the species going.

4. Skeptics are crap in bed. Smilie_PDT

Actually there is scientific proof that skeptics make more considerate, selfless, and adventurous lovers. Not to mention their stamina and creativity. Unfortunately this proof has been hidden in top secret government vaults and you'll just have to take my word for it. Unless.... :whistle:

the above post is by - donfie of UM ..its a great thread..I asked him If I could pinch it for here too..he said yup lol big grin

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vincent · **vincent**

I had to go look and see if #4 has in his post!

Yes it is Smilie_PDT

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NATIVE AMERICAN WISDOM

ericraven2003 · **ericraven2003**

I know how tired I get of hearing"you are so close minded."
Well, then your an idiot. LOL

When did it become bad to require proof before believing?

Guest · **Guest**

Chaoszerg · **Chaoszerg**

Trigger · **Trigger**

I totally agree, by withholding belief I ask questions and people flip the hell out on you for doing that. Smilie_PDT

Its funny because I am skeptical about most things but admire people for whatever they believe. Its only when belief structures start gaining power do I object and very very loudly.

That's why people tend not to know what to do with me. For example I am a skeptic regarding some aspects of Evolution and I get treated like crap the same way.

Its weird and I feel so mis undah stood. Embarassed