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BaccaBerri
Rank: Baby Berri
Joined: 06 Apr 2006
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Post subject: exorcism?
I was watching something on exorcism and I was thinking that if there really is a such thing then there would be in a sense demons that can effect living people....now I am a believer in ghosts because of personal experiences. And I would think it possible for an evil spirit to take over a person who was open to that type of control....but the idea of an exorcism seems to mainly go to the Catholic church, and they do have documentation of having done them....
Now all that being said if it is demons taking over what does that mean for the other side? As is known I'm not a believer in the bible I personally think it's one of the best works of fiction ever written.....I believe that any story especially the parables of the bible can be used to show basic ideas, just like the stories of today that are told to teach kids to be careful...you know the urban legands they just let you know about dangers and if they make you check your back seat or watch what is going on around you then you are a little better off etc..to me that's what the bible is....but what would stories of exorcisms teach? and the stories of them happening are told by people who were there not just i heard this etc....to be honest don't you think they hurt the church more then help it?
Or do you think that they are just like anything else in religion and the church has made them up to scare people even more? Do you think that the idea of demons, bad spirits with the power to take over is all a myth? if it is possible for the bad to do it why doesn't the good ever do the same? Is it just a hoax? is it possible? if it is what is causing it?
Just a few questions with my rambles lol what ya'll think
Sat May 20, 2006 2:18 pm
Bebi
Rank: The Odd Mod
Joined: 08 Apr 2006
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Personally I think that every religion has it's own form of exorcism, the Catholic version is just the most well-known. I'm sure Vince and the others who know about Native Americans could tell you of something similar. I know that Wiccans have rituals to draw bad spirits away from people/environments.
I think that because the Catholic Church tries to keep the exorcism ritual as hush hush as possible, people have just latched onto it as being something bigger than it is. Most people have this automatic reaction to the word "ritual" being associated with bad things, I mean how many people do you know who treat exorcism with a kind of reverent shocked awe, as if it's something ultra special...? It's just another ritual as far as I'm concerned.
The whole Demon thing... I don't really buy the whole Church stance on them, I've come to my own theory of them just being powerful spirits which personally I find more plausible. (waits for the Demonology backlash hehe) Mediums often accept spirits inside themselves, and the simple fact is it’s always the horror stories that are most popular. Add to that the fact that most “good” spirits wouldn’t impose on anyone who didn’t want them to. Think of it this way: The spirit world is no different to ours. There are “people” there from all walks of life, with all kinds of moral codes. Demons are basically the serial rapists and murderers of the Afterlife, toying with their living victims. Why do they do it? Because they can. I believe that the type of person you are in life dictates what kind of spirit you become after, and as society progresses and goes downhill it makes sense that the effects will be felt this way.
I don’t really class the Bible as 100% untruth; I see it as their way of understanding things at that point in time. They had none of the technology we do now. We know now roughly how old the Earth is, and have a good grasp of evolution. The people of that time had no idea of the things we now know so therefore you can understand their attempts to explain creation. To be honest I’ve no problem with the Catholic Bible (or any other) as such; it’s the people who believe in it that pose the problems, for example the fundamentalists who refuse to see any other way apart from their own. Everyone has their own interpretations and I don’t believe that it was ever meant to be a literal “Rule Book”, just a guide to living. Hey – maybe it’s the first ever Self-Help Guide LOL
Last edited by Bebi on Sun May 21, 2006 1:28 pm; edited 1 time in total
Sat May 20, 2006 2:30 pm
SilverCougar
Rank: Berri seed
Joined: 22 Apr 2006
Posts: 31
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Mmneh.. never one to believe in 'demonic possessions" or anything of the like really... and so that means excorsims are bupkiss to me as well X) _________________ I'll work on this when I feel compelled. And not lazy
Sun May 21, 2006 6:31 am
vincent
Rank: Berri Mod
Joined: 10 Apr 2006
Posts: 727
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Bebi wrote:
Personally I think that every religion has it's own form of exorcism, the Catholic version is just the most well-known. I'm sure Vince and the others who know about Native Americans could tell you of something similar. I know that Wiccans have rituals to draw bad spirits away from people/environments.
Interesting I will have to look into it. I don't know that much about the N/A aspect of evil spirits or exorcism. _________________ NATIVE AMERICAN WISDOM
Sun May 21, 2006 11:13 am
Bebi
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Joined: 08 Apr 2006
Posts: 638
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I've found this information so far regarding exorcism and other religions. I'll keep looking
Exorcism in Judaism
In kabbalah and European Jewish folklore, a person may be possessed by a malicious spirit called a dybbuk — which is believed to be the dislocated soul of a dead person, escaped from Gehenna (a Hebrew term very loosely translated as "hell", literally the valley outside Jeruselem where the city's garbage and dead bodies were burned. The word later came to mean "the valley of dead"). According to those beliefs, a soul which has not been able to fulfill its function in its lifetime is given another opportunity to do so in the form of a dybbuk. The dybbuk must be exorcised by a prescribed religious rite.
Exorcism in Islam
Possession by evil spirits (Jinn) or the Devil (Shaitan) and exorcism is said to have been a part of Islam since its beginning.
It is believed that the Jinn can gain control only over those who do not hold true to God. According to Islamic scholars, "The Jinni enters the one seized by fits and causes him to speak incomprehensible words, unknown to himself; if the one seized by fits is struck a blow sufficient to kill a camel, he does not feel it." (ibn Taymiyyah, Majmoo al-Fatawa.)
Islamic clergy caution against the overuse of exorcism, citing that most cases are due to psychological and physical causes mistaken for possession. Real cases of possession are very rare and the faithful are warned to watch out for exorcists who encourage a diagnosis of possession too quickly, as they may merely be seeking profit.
Islamic authorities also deny the possibility of possession by souls of deceased persons, and warn that evil spirits may make this claim in order to encourage sinful behavior among the living.
Hinduism: In Hinduism, the Vedas scriptures tells of an evil spirit that can not only harm humans, but can also stand in the way of the will of the gods. A traditional Hindu exorcism includes such rituals as burning pig excrement, reciting prayers and offering sweets to the Gods.
Exorcism in other religions
In Wicca, because no spirits/people/things are inherently evil, the practice of an exorcism would be unlikely. Demons however, in Witchcraft are often seen as psychological and non-corporeal.
In Shamanic cultures a form of spirit releasement exists. Anthropologist Michael Harner PhD, has argued that a form of exorcism exists in all shamanic cultures. Various new age proponents use a format of spirit releasement, and authors such as Ken Page have pioneered its popularity in that community.
Anti-Exorcism Faiths
Most popularly, in Sikhism, exorcism is disallowed absolutely and is seen as a gross violation of the Sikh Rehat Maryada, or Code of Conduct. If a Sikh person was to be found practising exorcism, an ordained Ghiyanhi or priest has the power to strip that individual of any ties to the Sikh faith. This anti-exorcism stance separates Sikhism from what are viewed as the barbaric exorcism rituals of Christianity, Judaism, Islam, Taoism and Shintoism.
I know of some Wiccans who use spirit releasement.
Shamanism made a great contribution to traditional dance through the kut, the Shamanistic exorcism ceremony In fact, some people believe the kut is the source of all Korean folk dance.
_________________
Why try so hard to fit in when you were born to stand out?
there are some 'evil' spirits that can do things that they would have to be asked or made to leave, not necessarily from a person but from a home etc......
So that type of being should fall under the same category, at least for these purposes.....
Wed May 24, 2006 1:29 am
Guest
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Allot of people seem to misunderstand what exorcism is about.
Imagine yourself in an undpredicted hypothetical situation, your with a friend or let's say even a room mate, one night while you sleep, you hear the pitter patter of nails or something scratching against the floorboards, you don't know where it's coming from as it's very dark and shadows sway from side to side given the moonlight shade, you close your eyes, but then you get this strange feeling, you wake up, and your room mate crawls slowly upwards to your bed much like a spider, with their eyes pitch black and enlarged, with it's hand much like a claw ready to gouge at your face, imagine this happening when you least expect it.
People don't want to believe this stuff because they don't see it, that simple, but if anything I would keep clear of any association with demons, evil spirits, whatever you classify it as is, because it's like playing with matches and fire, in a spiritual sense, and the aftermath is of negative results.
Exorcisms aren't taken lightly in spirituality, in fact I have quite allot of stories I could share, but of course if I did, you would take it for bunk, therefore why waste my time, but think hypothetically, as this is critical, if demons really do exist, they are looking at the skeptics like we would a monkey at the local zoo, keep that in mind and always consider the alternative before doubting the unknown.
By the way, here's a popular recording that came from a 16 year old girl in the whereabouts of Russia, this took place in an Orthodox chapel in 2004, whether or not it's scary, you have to think, this is a girl and the voice sounds nothing like her, hmmm?
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